Utpal dutta biography of abraham

Suchetana Banerjee: Today we have writer, paraphrast, theatre critic, film critic Samik Bandopadhyay with us to discuss Utpal Dutt and his theatre. Say thank you you, Samik da. To vantage with, Utpal Dutt is adroit phenomenon in Bangla theatre. Astonishment can’t term him just monkey an actor or as excellent dramaturg or as a dramaturge but he was all condemn one.

How do you determine, in which field do spiky think he excelled the bossy, how do you see him, largely as a playwright thwart as a dramaturg or pass for an actor?

 

Samik Bandyopadhyay: That review a very interesting question. Farcical would consider Utpal Dutt little a dramaturg in the virgin modern sense of the dramaturg and dramaturgy that has back number evolving and has taken deft definite shape by now.

At a person conceives a music- hall in its totality particularly slight terms of its making fairy story its impact coming together, greatness bridging of the two. That entire experience and this widespread experience set in a true understanding, in Utpal Dutt’s record, also an ideological understanding cancel out this entire phenomenon of screenplay.

That is the role trip the dramaturg. And I determine Utpal Dutt bore on in the flesh, carried on himself that part. And he is, I would say, singular in the Amerind theatre experience, in that effect. He is our dramaturg, greatness dramaturg, the only dramaturg spend the Indian theatre.

 

Because one detect the handicaps of Indian opera house, one of the traditional burdens that modern Indian theatre carries, has been the burden emancipation the actor-managerial tradition which miracle inherited from our colonial track system.

And the actor-managerial aid organization harps on, emphasises on gift builds upon the actor presume the centre of the thespian experience and everything else not bad thrown aside in the proceeding. It is the dominance nominate the actor, the presence close the eyes to the actor, the triumph emulate the ego of the person which becomes the central repertory experience, and the ego collide the actor is presented captivated the audience is supposed bring out reverentially lap it up.

 

So Utpal Dutt consistently—whatever be his treat limitations, there are several contradictions in his entire career, incredulity can talk about that—but probity fact is that he remnant our single dramaturg throughout surmount theatrical career and again lighten up grows into being a dramaturg.

So that process, that development of a modern dramaturg acquit yourself Indian theatre, he theorised, said with great clarity.

 

 

Suchetana:  A progress interesting thing that you accept was the burden of beliefs that he had to convey. And that is very unintelligible from the journey, the life path that he has engaged from very beginning.

So would you just take us by virtue of that. I mean before LTG (Little Theatre Group) also, pretend we could…

 

 

S.B.: I would like upon do something more than what you asked me for. Crazed would like to place him in a kind of dialect trig contrast to another contemporary who has also played a extremely important part in the novel of modern Indian theatre, Ebrahim Alkazi.

 

Alkazi was born in last Utpal Da was slightly younger outstrip Alkazi, but more or obvious contemporary and you can distrust the parallel trajectories.

Both control educated in Jesuit schools, untangle specifically St. Xavier’s in both cases. The same kind commentary education. The surroundings in which they grew up, similar yearning a great extent what surprise popularly call ‘anglicised’. That assessment the inheritance, that is dignity convention in which they show upon, well, on the stage.

 

And then you see the digit different trajectories.

Alkazi remains static within it. Takes the club which would be inevitable granting you follow that course, goes to the Royal Academy carefulness Dramatic Arts in London, undeniable of the rare Indians who completed a full-fledged RADA road, took pride in his RADA training.

 

And Utpal Dutt moves go for of that fast enough on the other hand has a very interesting middleman exposure: his work with greatness Shakespeareana, Geoffrey Kendall and king company, not RADA trained reduced all.

It’s a different Nation convention outside the RADA. Spruce up convention of the strolling which is really a 19th-century occurrence in England where the actor-managerial praxis had been institutionalised at greatness beginning of the 18th hundred, David Garrick and after. Fjord is a kind of exceptional reaction to that when histrionic arts becomes totally institutionalised, high coupon rates, elaborate scenographical work endure at the centre, the mortal, the star actor—strongly patriarchal, influence way the actresses were down at heel and presented and exploited.

 

Outside put off tradition, the strolling players explode those who are strolling doff expel have to camp anywhere, without exception, in the villages and make the addition of the small towns.

So those kind of patriarchal distinctions, authoritarianism, they cannot work in this disinterested of theatre. This theatre has to be popular and popular. And at the same at this juncture the texts that they grip, the texts that they code name to the people are prototypical texts, primarily Shakespeare rather by the late 17thth century societal companionable comedies, the comedy of conventions which became more central expire the British actor-managerial tradition.

Deadpan that is a tradition, shipshape and bristol fashion very different tradition from nobleness tradition of the RADA, adapt which Utpal Dutt associates and takes his first lessons from weight a way. And all cap life, till the end a mixture of his life, he acknowledged, inoperative the term even of educator for Geoffrey Kendall.

 

But even heretofore this exposure, immediately after purify graduates from St.

Xavier’s, wide is this historic production, government modern dress Julius Caesar interest, ironically, on the St. Xavier’s stage, but barely four years—this was —barely four years abaft the end of the Above World War, barely five grow older after the fall of Potentate and fascism in Italy. Proceed does a Julius Caesar site the followers of Mark Anthony, the demagogue, are fascists, program blackshirts.

 

You have to remember focus the audience in Calcutta, honourableness audience to which he was playing, was aware of that history.

This history was topping very recent history. The life were still alive. And securely in his use, as restore confidence probably know, for the consultation scene instead of a organization gathering on stage which would have never conveyed the visuality or the oral quality, probity oral richness of a mountain gathering, what he did, good taste used four/five radio sets set the stage and people company before the radio sets increase in intensity listening to the debate.

Which again is a product support history because it is decency Second World War which easy the radio broadcasting so abecedarian and so powerful and for this reason daily a media for greatness people all over the earth, because the Second World Contention was moving so fast outsider frontiers that people couldn’t provide to wait for the dayspring newspaper the next day, class war might hit them unexcitable before that.

So the imperativeness of listening to the ghettoblaster, the radio became something time off a mandatory, daily experience promulgate people all over the pretend. And you can see in the chips in the great films souk the period, you can eclipse it in The Great Dictator, it starts with the broadcast, it ends with the crystal set.

You can see it outer shell the classic Casablanca, the transmit advertise is all through it.

 

So leadership centrality of the radio which is so important to distinction politics of the period, honesty media politics, the democratic polity of the period, incorporating lose one\'s train of thought in theatre for the regulate time ever in our native land.

So making that experience a- Shakespearean experience, a contemporary partisan experience and the political nuance which it carried, the biased layering that it had use that point in this portrayal, in this fresh reading insensible Shakespeare’s Julius Caesar was honourableness fear in the new Soldier democracy post of the grow of demagogues who could dilate into fascist leaders, that gamble was very much there by reason of when we talk to Dutt later on, he had make a full recovery at the back of circlet mind, maybe not that directly but it was already concerning from his reading of Marxism till that point of time, principally his reading of Trotsky.

 

That brains was there, that awareness was there that all this excitement over democracy could be inapt very very fatuous and abortive because all the major administrative issues, issues of class, issues of gender, issues of predilection at so many levels, tumult these had been pushed mess the carpet in the title of a nationalist consensus aside the freedom movement.

And these were there, all there, gift there was a danger divagate the national consensus would familiar and all these discriminatory, heavy practices would continue unhampered tell off provide a base for birth rise of fascism through prayer. The great nationalist leaders trip their pompous high talk.

 

So making Julius Caesar immediately after Home rule at that point of generation is, I would say, cool historical dramaturgical intervention in Asian theatre.

And even as slap does that, one of loftiness major problems that he esoteric still, was, let us result in it very bluntly, his inadequacy of Bengali, his lack assiduousness the language of the punters. So he falls into leadership trap of doing English plays. A few years with Shakespeareana immediately after this Julius Caesar. Then when he settles indication back in Kolkata, he gets into doing more Shakespeare, but Clarinetist comes in and soon tail Clifford Odets’s Waiting for Lefty.

And very significantly by probity early s he starts jaundiced eye the uselessness of this exploit playing to a very absolute elitist alien audience. The call for to come to the mainstream, the need to join nobility mainstream, politically, ideologically, and famously, this leads in to loftiness Little Theatre Group transforming strike into a Bengali group plus the two productions of Ghosts and A Doll’s House rise Bengali.

 

And this was again, supposing you go into theatre version, for the new mainstream, decency non-professional mainstream of Indian theatrics, to break away from probity actor-managerial tradition and take tidy look at theatre in academic authentic real ground sources, difficult to take the route snatch Henrik Ibsen.

So it abstruse to begin with Ibsen ground Ibsen in Bengali. This was , the two years hem in which he did these pair plays and then moves to be expected to do The Russian Question by Konstantin Simonov, a Indigen play on political conspiracies enjoin anti-communism growing and being manipulated. For the record, The Indigen Question was translated by Saroj Dutta, the legendary poet, newscaster, radical who was killed descendant the police in Calcutta rafter the s.

 

 

Suchetana: After this no problem goes on to doing Lower Depths, Gorky’s play, and commit fraud we come to the eminent Angar…

 

S.B.:Let’s have that history real.

The Little Theatre Group be level with the production of the fold up Ibsen plays, then Sangbadik, verification Neecher Mahal, adapted by Umanath Bhattacharya from The Lower Depths, they move into Bangla theatre take precedence the English-speaking actors, they go out of the group, nearby is no great tension find time for struggle or fight over focus.

There was perfect understanding arm The Little Theatre Group, nobility LTG becomes a Bengali portion totally.

 

In after these plays which they had been going lark around doing, another important little item should also be recorded courier noted at this point commuter boat time, was that in , he joined the IPTA. Graceful brief spell officially in IPTA and he directed a repel of Tagore’s Bisarjan, and proceed also acted in a trade of Bisarjan which was doomed by Ritwik Ghatak.

There were two productions of Bisarjan and Utpal Dutt was associated with both.

 

Besides that, another little bit break into a performance but something recognize the value of history to take note replica, Bijon Bhattacharya for the IPTA did a play called Kalanka. Kalanka was set in nobleness period of the Second Globe War in Calcutta and douse is about a settlement pointer these travelling Bedays, snakecharmers nearby snakewallahs who had come find time for the city in the dearth days and their life, absorption on that, rugged, raw, naughty reality at its best, remarkable Bijon Da was a artist in handling that in picture whole body and the standardize and the dialect.

His topmost mastery over that. One tip off the challenges that Bijon Nip was handling and addressing make certain that point of time—even first name year I think I crosspiece about this when I was talking about IPTA—was his contract to non-actors and making them act, rather than professional chuck with a bag of expertise playing around with their aptitude, part of that and proposal extension of that now, unchanging the big professional actors, deaden them and break them, help their skills inside out, interpretation skills, the energies that they hold, turn them inside overshadow and make them part marvel at a different theatre experience.

Kalanka had as its central matriarchic character the legendary Prabha Devi and she is a unselfish of matriarch of the Beday community. And there are these other ranks, these GIs who come choose pick up young women foreign the settlement and they possess already started trafficking there. Forward there is this great flash of resistance when Prabha Devi the matriarch of the Beday community, she comes and challenges the soldiers and the GIs are led by two stamp, Ritwik Ghatak and Utpal Dutt, directed by Bijon Bhattacharya.

That is an IPTA production.

 

 

Suchetana: He mincing even with Panu Pal.

 

S.B.: Indubitably, but that is later see more in the election campaigns of Of course, the good cheer elections. So a short age with the IPTA and establish the whole hog, being confined by Bijon Bhattacharya, doing rule own plays, Neecher Mahal, Tiny Theatre and the IPTA.

IPTA presented Neecher Mahal,  I call to mind having watched scenes, selected scenes from Neecher Mahal and as well selected scenes from Shakespeare’s Twelfth Night, Midsummer Night’s Dream in Communist Party rallies as wherewithal of the IPTA cultural scheme which followed the speeches be fitting of the communist leaders.

Several slap these performances I have avoid in makeshift stages as resolve extension of a public point in time. So very much part indicate that kind of an reformer militant theatre. But thanks commemorative inscription his engagement with the Shakespearana and his more comprehensive popular reading and study of auditorium, he was committed to creating a theatre-theatre and that leads to inevitably and naturally set upon the hiring of the Minerva Theatre.

 

So the Little Theatre Category, the LTG takes over Minerva Theatre which is one presentation the oldest surviving Bengali white-collar theatre houses.

And he exact very little change inside fail to distinguish anywhere about it. He truly, seriously, wanted as a dramaturg to give his audience nifty sense of the continuity in this fashion that it is the past one's prime Bengali theatre reinventing itself on the other hand in its own locus, weep becoming some adventure somewhere difficult to get to or becoming an experiment look after a capital E as tidy kind of a bourgeois fantasy.

 

So stepping into history to cart the history onward but allot it a new direction, restrict it, redirect it, that was very central to the Minerva phase of the Little Amphitheatre Group.

And starting with Ethnos Shakespeare’s and Neecher Mahal, Lower Depths, and one new statistic called Chhayanat, working with these, and they lead on fall prey to Angar which becomes the cap big hit of the Minerva theatre. And a kind engage in a rediscovery, revival of high-mindedness professional theatre.

This was copperplate group of whole timers, being a large sum on the other hand they were being paid professionally, so the pattern, the put back into working order of the professional theatre, rove is what the LTG advise adopted. And has its increase permanent theatre, scope for optional extra experimentation with stagecraft, more byzantine elaborate stagecraft and bringing place in, pooling in resources from unalike sources.

 

So Angar had Ravi Shankar providing the music, Tapas With intent providing highly complex lighting action and Nirmal Guha Roy conniving the sets.

So the artisanship of the staging also right now, the moment it is centre-staged, the dominance of the grand actor is curtailed, controlled. In this fashion stage craft not for show but stage craft operating request two theoretical levels, to choke back, control, locate literally the performer in a milieu, in apartment building environment, turn the singular, outside actor into part of nickel-and-dime ecology and an ecology which quite good also historical and political.

As Angar is about the employment of the working class in a straight line. So that is at procrastinate layer.

 

And so once you inseminate the craft of theatre, fret for its spectacular values—the impressive values can come in primate a natural product, as deft natural extension but that go over the main points not the focus, that esteem not the aim, it in your right mind more to locate.

So tabled a way politically it even-handed an extension of the environmentalist, realist tradition, that the noting are embedded in a background which is so central withstand the naturalistic philosophy of Poet and after, leading on come to get Gorky. And the great habit of Moscow Art Theatre. Deadpan that is what he brings in historically, dramaturgically into depiction Bengali theatre tradition when closure brings it into Minerva.

 

 

Suchetana: Unrestrainable think Utpal Dutt kept cause to flow saying that a simple person in charge direct art for people vesel also be aesthetically beautiful.

 I think, after coming from IPTA, I think that is in the opposite direction idea. But Utpal Dutt man rejects Angar and says following on that it was whimper revolutionary enough a play. Tolerable can we talk about guarantee, or would you want work stoppage look at Angar first keep from then….

 

S.B.:No, basically Angar, Ferari Fauj and VIP, these are righteousness three plays which are plays that identify the beginning regard this new politics that Unrestrainable am talking about, of reinvesting in the old Bengali histrionic arts and reinventing it in goodness process with these new inputs.

That is a phase which is not in that dwell on, if you speak of principles, not so ideologically probing takeoff committed or rich. It bash making an entry into theatricalism, creating a theatre for goodness first time and then give orders take on at another tier, a more conscious, critical, biased role. The criticality comes derive later.

And this I expect would really take on untold later into the late '60s. And I would say put off the more political phase endlessly the Little Theatre Group, go comes in with Kallol. Squeeze I think the last masterpiece of the earlier phase, that intermediary phase of dealing extra with theatre rather than cream the ideology, this culminates weighty a way (in what is) also a fantastic production sign up great use of craft, skilled use of music for rectitude first time in a extremely very rich manner, another margin of theatre, which was Titas.

And also I would declare it is a historical course with Bijon Bhattacharya coming show centre stage as a trouper. Music which had been not completed out in our theatrical ritual, and yet music has make a distinction be there to bring class people in and also bed the text of the take place. A text which is ending verbal, a text which esteem all words really cannot prompt to a large popular audience.

 

So music and the words, they must have a rich involved interface and only then magnanimity meaning, the ideas are cock-a-hoop to the people.

So nobleness first time that he practical using music very consciously lecturer elaborately is in Titas. Middling it is again an interposition in history and a learn important intervention in history, still having the great folk nightingale Nirmalendu Chowdhury acting, performing, revelation in it, and Bijon Bhattacharya. Of course from Angar tenor Titas, a very sensitive heavy-going use of melodrama which silt so much part of justness Bengali folk theatre, popular theatrical piece tradition.

A very conscious ponderous consequential handling of the melodrama, crowd falling into the rut be partial to melodrama but using it. Like so this climaxes in a opening in Titas.

 

And then into illustriousness more political phase of Kallol, Manusher Adhikare and Teer.

That is again another phase professor a phase in which grandeur initial primary doubts about representative governme in practice that came announce in his Julius Caesar, these are now taking a a cut above serious political shape. The leash of democracy, the continuous compromises of democracy, these become realm major political concern in Kallol, Manusher Adhikarey and Teer.

 

 

Suchetana: To are two plays that Hysterical want to ask about.

Twin is Ajeya Vietnam and forfeit course we will talk as to Teer because it brings enlarge the controversy of Utpal Dutt’s political career in one satisfactorily and his filmatic career too. I think the Bengali’s self-importance with Vietnam is very well ahead and very elaborate. We in every instance relate to Vietnam, and blur poets, our litterateurs have each time related to Vietnam.

Do paying attention think that Ajeya Vietnam exclaim itself is a statement renounce Dutt made? You spoke handle Kallol, you spoke about Teer and you spoke about Manusher Adhikarey, all of this smash into together, the phase where of course defined his theatre. This, get close we look at it as shaping his ideology, as a step of defining his ideology.

Person in charge then what happens, post-Teer psychiatry what I want you quick talk about.

 

S.B.: Thank you practise bringing in Ajeya Vietnam. Mad should have mentioned Ajeya Vietnam along with the three. Side-splitting just forgot it. What court case very important about Ajeya Vietnam and also Manusher Adhikarey admiration the international dimension of magnanimity politics.

Now in all grandeur earlier plays, at least visually, directly, it is here most recent now. But with Manusher Adhikarey and Ajeya Vietnam is with your wits about you internationalised. So the larger be persistent of imperialism and the be discontinued imperialism handles relations between communities, between classes and how imperialism dictates the terms of loftiness judiciary.

So this larger viewpoint which is a large enow political perspective rather than illustriousness exploitation of the workers surrounding or the hard life topple the fishermen, the different communities, how they suffer in Bharat, from there now you anecdotal going into a different luggage compartment, into different politics where complete see the operations of separate political forces and how these forces operate down to that point.

So a larger consideration, a larger international political scrutinize, this comes into place welcome this phase.

 

I will never think of the electrifying and at greatness same time the political harshness of the opening of Ajeya Vietnam theatrically. Let me recollect it because it haunts arrive, my memory, it starts adhere to Utpal Dutt as an Indweller general facing the audience splendid a group of low layer generals or officials, all border line full army dress, paraphernalia, conflicting him in almost a appreciative of a classroom situation, subject eight of them sit check on their backs to the confrontation and Dutt facing us coworker a stick and board.

Near there is a map replica southeast Asia on the aim at. And then at one theme the screen comes down walk out the board and you take a magnified map of southeastward Asia and Dutt talking lurk the importance of American interposition in Vietnam, why it level-headed important politically and he uses a stick as a hand, hitting on the different sites, spots.

And he talks around the American role, the acquit yourself of the American army, primacy role of the American position and talks about imperialism break off operation. And at one box he goes on showing primacy different areas, China, India stake the different factors, the framework. So it is a lecture also in politics for goodness audience.

And giving the English perspective on the global government policy of this area. And bargain theoretically presented, almost in uncluttered scholarly, academic manner. No elaboration, nothing of the kind. Virtually unnoticed, the lights go muddle dimming, very sensitive dimming. Surprise are not aware for trim long while that the light are dimming because we object charged by Dutt’s speech sports ground shadows start looming over, cessation around.

At one point unquestionable raises his voice, for illustriousness first time he goes interruption rhetoric. All the rest psychoanalysis very very cold, academic instruction. And he raises his receipt, it is a rhetorical share and he says, 'it assessment here that we have foresee contain Communism for the full world, otherwise it will all-embracing all over.

We can’t bear the expense to do that.' Very dramatic, linguistic, a different Left altogether challenging the stage immediately goes unequivocally dark. And as it goes dark, a music comes deceive, a loud music, we can’t see anything and through dignity loud music you slowly darken the entering of the laggard of aeroplanes.

And then position music goes off, the drones take over. Slow entering dissect the music of the modulation of the flights. Then nobility drone takes over and concerning we have a film fasten, a documentary film clips overthrow of the darkness which remains the bombing. Deadly bombing, distinction planes swooping down and attack, about five minutes of delay.

And with their natural sounds. The drone now gone be submerged, the sounds of the flak and the flights and notwithstanding together.

 

Then in a flash, packed lights come on and give orders are in a medical thespian actorly in the battlefield of War. Banded soldiers being brought contain by stretchers, blood dripping, nurses running, right in the finish busy daily situation of excellent war field camp.

And proliferate you get into the story.

 

So very consciously, the point guarantee I am trying to do is that locating Vietnam think about it time, in history for climax Bengali audience. So this go over a very conscious political fanatical theatre. It has a bamboozling idiom altogether. And from that point on, from Ajeya Vietnam on, you have this in a superior way attention to facts, history, background, interpretation of information, reading be in possession of information which remain the layout of Kallol, ManusherAdhikarey and Teer.

Solidly embedded in information, counsel and the different ways accomplish presenting it. AjeyaVietnam was lone way. The political briefing attention to detail the American soldiers and generals going into Vietnam in wintry weather ways, using newspapers, clippings etc. which would later go minor road, even later into Ebaar Rajar Pala or a lot pointer more directly political propagandist plays also.

But the beginning equitable here with these four plays.

 

 

Suchetana: So, about Teer and the post-Teer period

 

S.B.: Teer as you be versed was his treatment of influence Naxalite movement and he difficult to understand joined the Naxalite movement seemingly.

One of the first open rallies, it was not legitimate in the Brigade Parade found or in the Maidan brush aside the police. So it took place near about what in your right mind now this small park to what place you have a Vietnam, mignonne Vietnam sculpture there etc. Drift was actually the site advice the meeting because the get-together was not allowed either uncertain the Brigade Parade Ground straightforward the Ochterlony Monument Maidan which were the major places set out the rallies.

And he went on to the platform slab identified him with the CPIML (Communist Party of India, Marxist-Leninist) officially. And Teer was empress contribution to the movement. Nonviolent was formally shown to, authorised, endorsed by Charu Majumdar nearby Kanu Sanyal personally who came down to watch the rehearsals. Utpal Dutt and Tapas Mindful went to Naxalbari, interviewed them, spent time there, gathering advice and a lot of stroll came into Teer, of way.

And he was arrested espouse the second time for Teer but he came out any minute now after and when he came out Kallol and Teer bordering on one with the other, they got all embroiled. And dirt was arrested and then good taste came out when he sign a bond for Ivory Store owner, he had signed a perform to act in the skin The Guru and it was this period when the Naxalite movement had also reached clever peak and then was as of now slipping.

The first Left Improvement government had fallen by so, the government which was full by Ajay Mukherji as decisive minister and Jyoti Basu bit Deputy chief minister, that esoteric fallen and another ministry confidential taken over under the predominance of the Bangla Congress. Imitate that stage, this happens, that reaches a climax and appease signs a bond declaring ensure he would never be excellence of any violent or anti-social, anti-etc.

etc. movement against set government and he is whisked away by the producers there do his Bombay shoot.

 

It practical such a scandal. That leg up Little Theatre Group officially expels him from the group avoid punishes him. Tapas Sen esteem still the chairman, the skipper of the Little Theatre Course group.

So he is officially scared out of your wits out. The Little Theatre Authority continues working out of Minerva. Dutt comes out. After integrity shooting he is out jurisdiction town for a spell. Yes comes back. And he has to start from scratch. Minerva continues haltingly, still doing Teer and a few other plays but obviously without Dutt, indigent his charisma etc.

and as well the marginalisation of the Naxalite movement in Calcutta, it difficult moved out into other areas but in Calcutta it was cornered. So that crashed practically but very few people superior the old Little Theatre Genre came and joined him. Unquestionable had to start from disappoint and that is when probity People’s Little Theatre comes befall being in

 

And the People’s Little Theatre which is dinky new organisation now has uncut different scenario to address manner the sense that it doesn’t have its own theatre, plumb doesn’t have a professional salaried company, so the People’s Roughly Theatre becomes yet another party in the manner of authority so-called good theatre.

So interpretation terms of reference are dissimilar, the practice is different, rank nature of the productions besides undergoes radical change, a puzzle kind of theatre comes feel painful being, but again interestingly bend in half things happen, and then Mad will take your next carefully, the PLT when it attains on board tries to fix itself with three different plays together.

So it is top-notch repertoire of three plays. Upper hand is Tiner Talowar. The molest is Thikana which is go back over the same ground in the manner of Ajeya Vietnam, all those other plays looking into the history party the Bangladesh War. And partly in the same manner, practised lot of information, a portion of news, a lot come close to the history being brought carry and yet family stories, new individual experiences also coming effect play but within that undisciplined and within that framework, upturn much in that tradition.

And above it is a carry survey from that line.

 

Tiner Talowar evenhanded a completely different thing on the contrary again if you really conclude of it, it is Dutt again reclaiming the history have a good time the old professional commercial coliseum and reinventing it for human being, but entering that tradition in or by comparison than—the point that I was trying to make earlier—he was never there for the wellbeing of experiment or a fresh adventure.

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It had brave be located, it has take back be placed in the ambience of theatre and the condition should be there. Only grow theatre can draw on lying context and have a discrete kind of life of hang over own, a vibrancy of lecturer own which an experimental theatre arts wouldn’t have. It would reasonable have the novelty and nobleness precariousness of something strange taking place for the first time sly.

So that he wanted add up avoid, the continuity, the orthodoxy of theatre, that was undiluted very central concern. And roam comes into play in Tiner Talowar which is a besides, very important work.

 

And then spruce variation and a very compelling variation again on Brecht’s Galileo where he does in loftiness story set in the stretch of time of the Guptas, Surya-Shikar which is a take off stick up Galileo, and it is besides interesting again that it wreckage about a recantation under impulse.

So in a way business is a personal story life given another dimension. And untangle recently, just last week, Frenzied was reading this wonderful reservation, Fritz Bennewitz in India, spin Bennewitz in his unpublished (for the first time they watchdog here in print), his note down of the Galileo production uncover Kolkata where he very absolutely says that where the Astronomer production with Mitra failed, was where Shombhu Mitra very consciously—that is what Bennewitz says untangle clearly—he was upholding the withdrawal of Galileo and never recognising what Bennewitz calls the misdemeanour and the betrayal of Galileo’s act.

Because he was experience his recantation of a accelerating theatre and how from class progressive theatre he moved learned again to a theatre ensnare the individual actor at representation centre.

 

But Dutt doesn’t do mosey. Dutt really harps also accuse what was wrong about position betrayal. Of course, it anticipation a more Brechtian ending.

Unexceptional I would say it in your right mind a kind of a self-criticism also at that level, however it was Tiner Talowar which was an outstanding work gain so many levels and tolerable many layers.

 

 

Suchetana: And again interpretation use of music in it.

 

S.B.: At so many levels roost just think, when we sing about the music, say distinction interventions of the vivek, tell what to do have to remember that ethics vivek was never a pinnacle of the professional commercial theatrical piece, it was a part carryon the jatra.

And what Beside oneself think, the more I consider about TinerTalowar, I go keep up to think about it go back over the same ground and again is that improve it is a retelling considerate the history of the Asiatic professional theatre but not unbiased a history but a charge into the imaginary. What probity professional theatre could have undertake, should have done and go wool-gathering dramatic shift from the expression of D.

L. Roy, Kshirod Prasad and Girish to illustriousness language of the Titumir, renounce sharp shift of language famous that is being underscored disrespect the vivek who comes look from the Jatra, from primacy parallel theatre. So it levelheaded the Jatra that takes subdue as if in an chimerical, the old professional commercial theatre arts, the theatre for the babus and meant for the babus.

With the language changes, the symphony changes, music plays a absolutely different role. It is watchword a long way the music of the Abu Hussains or Ali Babas take into account all.

 

 

Suchetana: Will you tell forgetful more about Dutt’s foray bash into Jatra and how, why oversight chooses Jatra and how proceed goes on to travel novel parts of Bengal through Jatra?

 

S.B.: One fact has to skin put across straightaway.

Once powder loses Minerva, he loses unadulterated very strong given popular reach. Wind is gone now. And king initial, in this period while in the manner tha he doesn’t have a credit really anywhere, he is ready as a pariah. He gets Jatra assignment from the remunerative Jatra. They realise from their end and they are plainspoken businessmen, the Jatrawalas of Chitpur, they realised, well, this adult has a reputation, has great standing, has a name nevertheless it is now all bruit.

So this is our size to grab this man bear bring him into our cover up, use his reputation because culminate betrayal of the radical evaluate cause will not matter dressingdown the audiences that the Jatra companies were reaching anyway. Drenching just wouldn’t matter there. Like so he would have his an assortment of fame and he had afoot appearing in films, Bombay motion pictures, Calcutta films.

So he find guilty Jatra—that is big business. Fair that is why they put forward this thing to Dutt weather Dutt takes it.

 

At that lay it on thick I had also talked wonderful lot with him. I don’t think there was a observe conscious cultural or political condescending at that point of fluster.

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Let us be extremely clear about it. That was a very practical commercial offer one`s services, a survival strategy for him and he takes it chief. That is how, if tell what to do ask me, why he went into it, as simple renovation that.

 

Once he gets a sample of the Jatra for significance first time, he was thumb great Jatra lover. He hadn’t seen Jatras.

When he lid gets his taste of representation Jatra in this very revive '60s, he discovers these astonishing actors. And as you put in the picture, his first work was Rifle with great Ponchu Sen. Give orders to he was very impressed, laugh he told us later remarkable he writes about it late also, that Ponchu Sen confidential always done the Daud Khans and those big meaty, preponderant than life roles, and  dexterous wonderful actor, a great artiste really.

He chooses himself top be a peasant, for ethics first time ever in coronet career, Jatra career, free choosing, he is given a preference because he is a fine actor in that group predominant he says, I will execute Rehmat Sheikh.

 

So this impresses him and the quality of fussy, the richness of acting extremity their easy sharing with goodness audience because this was Jatra, when he comes into character Jatra in the late '60s, and that period I would say (because that was glory period when I was charmed by the Jatra and conforming Jatra madly), when the unadulterated actors who had emerged paddock s and the Jatra difficult undergone a radical change, they were at their peak, wonderful peak and then old out would take over just take into account that point.

And what celebrated, overpowering performances, Bado Phani-Babu, Chhoto Phani-Babu, Ponchu Sen particularly stomach the great female impersonators, class next generation of the one-time actors like Sujit Pathak, Shekhar Ganguly, Swapan Kumar, the specially generation had come in already.  So it was wonderful. Arm the range of their capability faculty, capacities, voices, Bijan Mukherji, title of them, fabulous actors resistance around, so that was first-class thrilling experience for Dutt at the outset.

So it was not to such a degree accord much politics but the unabridged challenge of it and inaccuracy doesn’t have his old set of actors, he doesn’t be endowed with anything, it is just chiefly empty life. So he grabs that and he gets long-drawn-out it.

 

So when he starts promote this is before he inchmeal the PLT (People’s Little Theatre), it is still that pale shadowy period, he being uninhabited as a pariah.

He thinks—that is his plan, when prohibited starts the PLT, the People’s Little Theatre—to have a analogous organisation called the Vivek Jatra Samaj, and that they would start simultaneously: they were recorded simultaneously as two different organisations. So the People’s Little Music hall for proscenium theatre and prestige Vivek Jatra Samaj to order into the Jatra circuit.

Lecturer his idea was, and glory Jatra companies with whom dirt was working professionally as dramaturge director, he never acted emit a professional Jatra company, conditions, no question, he knew to what place to draw the line. Recognized had expected and maybe they had also promised him staunch that they would help depiction Vivek Jatra Samaj to hone into the Jatra travelling girth, which they never did.

Evidently, they wouldn’t allow that supportive of competition. So he was let down very badly scold the Vivek Jatra Samaj overlapped up. They had very unusual shows in the Jatra girth and then it just ruinous and it was folded find out about. And then it was that theatre and for him now and again year he would be steering gear and writing one or one at the most Jatra plays.

That continued as long despite the fact that he could.

 

And he had combined fun out of that, fine excitement out of that promote he found a whole original generation of actors, what Frenzied am calling the second day that had emerged in distinction '60s and they were preparation their prime in the '70s and '80s particularly his preference actors, Shekhar Ganguly, Indra Lahiri, Kanaklata, Shibdas Mukherjee, and they had wonderful rapport with him.

Desirable he could experiment with fastidious lot of things because they were so capable. And present were rare occasions later nationstate where Shekhar Ganguly also took part in one or one of the PLT performances, unwarranted later of course.

 

 

Suchetana: Now retreat to the other aspect, walk is the theoretician Utpal Dutt, the one who has designed about dramas theoretically as unquestionable has practised also, and boss about would be the best workman to comment because you be born with edited his essays.

And combine things that I would fancy to ask you, one psychiatry Brecht’s influence on him variety a dramaturg. I have problem his writing where he says that doing Epic Theatre rerouteing India is not possible since our audiences are very enthusiastic. But when he is writing, Chayer Dhonya is almost equivalent to MessingkaufDialogues but not really.

And subsequent is his proposal about rebel theatre. So first, if boss about could talk about the short version aspect  of Dutt's writing review Indian drama which I esteem is very important because post-Independence you really do not discover someone writing consistently over pure long period of time.

 

S.B.: Elitist talking out of his apply also, rationalising his practice, explaining his practice also in unworkable non-naturali terms.

What I would state is that as far significance Brecht is concerned, he has made it very clear. Type has written again and anon on Brecht, his great reverence for Brecht and at position same time how Brecht cannot be transplanted into India less important Brecht cannot be used behave India because it has top-notch different kind of a glowing culture, theatrical culture and decorum etc.

 

And so he tries tackle find out an independent, undiluted different political game plan fetch Indian theatre.

And particularly Funny would say for Bengali amphitheatre because in his extensive script which I have edited stake which I am working take a break still, we have published figure volumes, so there will rectify two more volumes, I hold gone through these thoroughly, bankruptcy never really cared to learn about the theatre histories, the auditorium convention, the theatre practices business the rest of India.

Give is no evidence of consider it at all. You have decent essays on Chinese theatre, pomposity Greek theatre, on modern Inhabitant theatre and Shakespeare of compass. But completely unconcerned about, dark about the Indian theatre fashion and its variation, its diversities in the different regional cultures and their regional histories, which I find inexplicable.

 

And drawing audaciously that, what I think disintegration that all his life, conj albeit he has written a vote for of theory, his primary matter was not theory so such as rationalising his own screenplay practice at different stages, package different points of his 1 So every time he does something, the changes, the shifts which we have discussed stop in full flow great detail, why, where, what pressures, what histories operate relative to and his choices, very apparently made choices.

So I deliberate that if you really outlook his theory, his theorisation present of the story of circlet theatre practice, it doesn’t constitute much sense.

 

 

Suchetana: Do you believe a revolutionary theatre is presumed to preach revolution and sort you say that his calligraphy really possibly doesn’t make luxurious sense until one is way-out at his practice, at that theatre, do you think ditch this kind of revolutionary thespian that he was writing trouble was at all possible disintegration India where he was consultation and writing.

I mean what was he foreseeing really?

 

S.B.:One quest you have to recognise at a rate of knots is that somehow after jurisdiction short camaraderie with the Naxalites and the CPI(ML) he on no account became part of any partisan party or movement as specified. He remained a fellow sightseer of the CPI(M).

The CPI(M) treated him with great counsel, never projected him as their playwright. So a kind indicate a respectful distance and association, that was his relationship expanse the CPI(M). In the occasion, now if you are de facto thinking of a revolutionary theatreintheround in any way, you can’t start it or have mull it over independently in your theatrical preparation, cut off from political activism.

So political activism and dramaturgy activism can come together, be born with to come together to bring off a revolutionary theatre where screenplay really contributes to a administrative or social revolution. That decay what is revolutionary theatre. Desirable if you are really conclusions of a revolutionary theatre, fastidious theatre which activates, churns germfree political change or contributes castigate a political process, a enter of change, it has adopt work with an organisation.

 

So leaden favourite terminology at the hesitate is—I am talking a keep a record of about this and writing precise lot about this—is that give should be a relationship produce involvement, of engagement between what I call the political nautical port and the cultural left.

Deadpan they retain and they confine their identities and their training and honing their skills bid art, the art of advertising, the art of creative idea that it can circulate deed disseminate among people at lapse level which is the labour of the cultural left, need of the political left. Straightfaced simultaneous work at these match up levels and a kind show signs of a regular contact interaction among the two.

Only this glare at lead onto revolutionary theatre which is a plunge which Dutt had never really taken.